I'm Not O.KK
Welcome to I'm Not O.KK, a fresh and engaging podcast where we dive deep into the world of mental health with authenticity, empathy, and a dash of humor. Hosted by two dynamic voices Kimberly Jahns and Kelly Kranz, each episode brings to light aspects of mental health history through storytelling and today's personal stories and triumphs that remind us we're not alone in our struggles.
Every other week we tell a story related to mental health and wellness. With candid conversations we want to dismantle the stigmas surrounding mental health, offering our listeners a safe space to reflect on their own experiences and find comfort in shared stories.
Each episode ends with engaging discussions during the book club portion of our podcast where we dive deep into mental health themes.
As your hosts, we don't just navigate these conversations from a distance; we're right there with you, sharing our battles and breakthroughs. Our goal? To infuse each discussion with laughter and levity, proving that even in our darkest moments, a spark of joy can be found.
I'm Not O.KK is more than just a podcast; it's a community. Whether you're seeking solace, understanding, or just a good laugh amidst the chaos of mental health challenges.
Because when you're here, you're never alone.
I'm Not O.KK
Selena Gomez: From Wizard to Popstar to Advocate
We shine a spotlight on Selena Gomez's inspiring journey. Travel with us from her early days on "Wizards of Waverly Place" to her current role as a mental health advocate. Through her battles with lupus, a kidney transplant, and bipolar disorder, Selena's resilience and openness have sparked crucial conversations about mental health.
Email us at notokkpodcast@gmail.com
We appreciate you!
Welcome to the I'm Not Okay K podcast.
Speaker 2:I'm Kelly Kranz.
Speaker 1:We gotta work on that. We gotta work on that. I'm Kimberly and I'm Kelly Kranz. How is everybody? Welcome to the show. It's gonna be a good one. We got tigers, lions, we got bears, we got fucking meerkats.
Speaker 2:We have none of that. No, we don't have any of that expectations this is just like how you should lower your expectations for life. You know what? Oh, I love that?
Speaker 1:I love that quote. I think I told you before high hopes and low expectations, and then you can never be disappointed, isn't that?
Speaker 2:interesting. There's another quote that's like oh yeah, yeah, the classic quote prepare for the worst, expect the best.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I guess it's like oh yeah, yeah, the classic quote prepare for the worst, expect the best. Yeah, I guess it's like that. Well, the one that I pulled it's from you, remember? I think the show's still on Million Dollar Listing. Of course, they all have like little phrases that they say when they come on, yeah, yeah, it was from one of those dudes, that was his phrase. It was from the really cocky dude I don't know They've changed so many dudes over the time, but they have yeah, that's where it's from. I pulled it from him. I was like I'm gonna take it from that asshole. I like it.
Speaker 2:It's funny there's on sister wives. My favorite one is where she's like love multiplies, it doesn't divide, or something.
Speaker 1:Or maybe she just says love multiplies because I go sister wives and I'm just like.
Speaker 2:I like that, maybe not in a sister wife way, but I like that quote.
Speaker 1:You can apply it differently, not to you're about to have multiple wives as sisters, like that's too much. No, I don't think I can do that.
Speaker 2:I'm very, I'm a very jealous person, are you? Yes, like when my dog likes other people more than me, I get upset I don't think that's possible.
Speaker 1:Walter is no. That's not possible.
Speaker 2:Don't do that to walter I always say you could steal my dog with a ham sandwich, because he is so food motivated and he just jumps in people's cars because he's like, is there food in there? I'm like buddy, like let's have some class and some standards, and he's like no, I will eat whatever you have it's so funny.
Speaker 1:There's no stranger danger for him.
Speaker 2:Give me the food oh, absolutely not, did I tell you that time? So I had a dog cam in my apartment. Okay, whatever, you know, it was a gift so I could watch Walter when I'm at work.
Speaker 1:Oh, I had that too yeah.
Speaker 2:So I had maintenance coming over because they had to fix something. And I just let them know. Like, hey, I have a dog. So I see on the camera, they knock. I know that because Walter gets up and starts barking. Then they open the door. My dog gets a toy, gets excited, brings it to this person who he's never met before in his life. He gets something scratchy from this person. Then the guy needs to do maintenance. He gets up and goes into the apartment, needs to do maintenance. So he gets up and like, goes into the apartment. Oh, what does my dog do? He goes and he lays on his bed and he goes back to sleep. I'm like, oh great, buddy, I'm not even there and you're not protecting my apartment, like you do nothing but look cute.
Speaker 1:He's just chilling. He's like that is my job. That's my job, mom. I'm just supposed to look cute and make you happy, like doesn't this look cute? Don't you like it Look stranger danger Come into the house.
Speaker 2:Come into the house. This is good. I love it. Yeah, exactly Exactly. He's like the welcoming committee for strangers than anybody who wants to take anything.
Speaker 1:That's so cute.
Speaker 2:Yeah so.
Speaker 1:Oh, walt. Walt is the opposite of effie, but no, not in the sense of food motivation though, because effie is, so I sometimes I think she doesn't love me. She just loves the fact that I have food all the time. So most likely most likely, I mean we're 10 years in, so I'm hoping there's some love there.
Speaker 2:But you know, just a little bit. It is what it is she's a happy camper.
Speaker 1:She's a happy camper. It is what it is she likes. It is what it is she likes food.
Speaker 2:I'll give her food. Yeah, you do what you got to do to keep the dog happy, you know.
Speaker 1:You know, you know, don't you know? You know, All right, our two degrees. You want to step into that? Absolutely, just take a hop and a skip and a jump and just two degrees.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so for mine it was a glass of water every morning, which I'm proud to say I do pretty much like almost every day. So I've been doing pretty well for that.
Speaker 1:So I like to keep doing that.
Speaker 2:My next two degrees is I'd like to lower the intake of my caffeine, preferably like. I'll still have coffee, but like, but it would just be less caffeinated. I don't want decaf completely, but maybe half-caf or something. But that's what I'd like to do because I've. Okay, what's your face?
Speaker 1:I can recommend a coffee for you. I'm currently doing half-caf coffee. It stems from mushrooms, so it's different. No, not the fun mushrooms. No, it's delicious.
Speaker 2:No, I still's different. No, not like. No, not the fun mushrooms. No, it's, it's delicious. No, I still don't. No, I'm going to give it to you.
Speaker 1:I'm going to show you it and you just Google it and look at it.
Speaker 2:I already can tell I can't afford it. No, thank you.
Speaker 1:You can. It's K cups and everything. Oh, we don't have that. Oh, I'm sorry, I should have gotten you that for your wedding.
Speaker 2:No, I have a Keurig, but we don't use it. We don't use the Keurig because we have a Breville, oh, okay.
Speaker 1:I have no fucking idea what that is.
Speaker 2:We grind it fresh every morning.
Speaker 1:Oh, we're over here grinding shit yeah. I don't know how you grind mushroom coffee, so you're on your own. But I'm sorry, I interrupted your two degrees, so that's what's it.
Speaker 2:So just lowering my intake of caffeine, that's my two degrees.
Speaker 1:Tee me up. What was mine last week? Yours was booking the.
Speaker 2:Pilates class, so that didn't happen.
Speaker 1:I actually froze my account. I froze my mental, the opposite. I took inventory of what's going on in my life and something that I cannot do at the moment is drive 30 minutes to a class every night around dinnertime and then I spend two hours there because I take two classes, because it's 30 minutes away, and then I drive 30 minutes home. So I just can't justify doing that right now because I'm training to become the Pilates teacher, I'm working on a side project and I have a job, and I think there's one more thing in there too.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, we do this fucking podcast, so I just had to put I have my springboard here so I could just work out here and I'm doing the training. So, anyway, that's a long story. So I guess my new two degrees now would be I've gotten better with email, but I think that's just like exposure therapy, yeah. So I think my new two degrees is going to be I've been really I've had really bad anxiety lately, so I've been working on my anxiety techniques. I want to continue doing that, but it's hard for me to think of a two degrees today. Hmm, I can't pivot off my last one because I just shut that shit down.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you did Help me Building your fire pit gardening more answering emails before five o'clock PM.
Speaker 1:Shut up. I still have emails I haven't answered from Monday.
Speaker 2:Oh my gosh, it stresses me out. Don't even talk to me.
Speaker 1:No, I think my two degrees is going to be more about my relationship with my partner. I think I need to be more intentional about my actions and what I'm doing and what I'm bringing to the relationship. So something that I did set which is a two degrees so I'll introduce it here is I'm planning to cook dinner at least two nights a Like. I love to cook. I used to have a job cooking but I fell out of practice doing that. So I'm going to cook dinner for him and I two nights a week. I mean, he's on a shift for 12 hours a day. I think it'd be nice if he came home to a home cooked meal, but it's just not something I was ever really intentionally doing because I was trapped in my own little vortex. So, yeah, that's my two degrees. So last night I did it, and then I have one more to do this week Legit, legit, oh. And then we have a two degrees-o a write-in. Read it, girl. Yeah, it's my time to read it today. All right Starts out. Hey, okay, okay.
Speaker 1:I've been struggling with anxiety for years. My anxiety spirals out of control so fast. I worry about everything work, relationships, even leaving the house some days. Yeah, tell me about it. Seriously, she is telling us about it. I started by setting a five minute timer. In the morning or the evenings I try and write down my worries. It's either the worries at the end of my day or the worries that I wake up with in the morning. It was a tiny step for me, but I'm finding that it helps me. I've never done journaling before and I think this might be a way to take on my anxiety. Now I'm slowly building on that, adding little coping strategies day by day. Thanks for helping us anxious folks feel less alone and more empowered. Emma from Boston. It's cool. I like when I read Cool. Thank you, emma from Boston.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's cool.
Speaker 1:I think it is great, it is cool. I mean, yeah, you have to be intentional again, intentional about your anxiety. I've been told to write down my thoughts. I've never done it because I'm a stubborn bitch, but I've been told that that can be incredibly useful. So, yeah, keep at it. That's awesome. Thanks for sharing. Yeah, thank you for sharing. Yeah. Not always easy to open it up. I'm making so many noises today, but I really appreciate it. You're like your own sound effects machine. I am. We need a soundboard? No, we don't.
Speaker 2:No, we don't, no, we don't. So what's the story for today, girl?
Speaker 1:My turn. Yeah, I got a good one, I got, I think I got a good one. I mean, you'll like it. So the sources for my story are going to expose what my story is about, but I will tell you I am doing this story on Selena Gomez. But I will tell you I am doing a story on Selena Gomez and her mental health journey, her advocacy, the things that she's experienced that have been documented. So that is who I'm talking about today. I'm a fan of her, Loved her forever.
Speaker 2:Yeah, she's been very open about her mental health, even her physical health.
Speaker 1:So cool. I look forward to listening. Yeah, she's got a good story. So there's a lot of sources for today's story. I'm just going to read a few of them here. So we have an article from Turnbridge, selena Gomez and her mental health journey. We have an article from todaycom Selena Gomez is lupus and health journey in her own words. From WebMD, there's an article Selena Gomez opens up about how therapy changed her life. There's also my Mind and Me, the documentary that Selena Gomez was in. That is also a source, and the Rare Impact Fund. That was a source as well. But for all the sources, you could check the show notes, because there's a lot. Okay, starting out, selena Marie Gomez was born on July 22nd 1992 in Prairie, texas, and has been in the public eye since childhood. Her career began at the age of seven when she appeared on the children's show Barney and Friends Fucking love Barney. What is it? Baby Bop and BJ? Yes, what is it? Baby bop and BJ.
Speaker 2:Yes, yes, I never watched it, but I saw episodes of her in them, like once she came to fame I saw the pictures or the little videos where she was. In it she was a cutie.
Speaker 1:God, I fucking love Barney. That's the five-year difference between us. You missed out on Barney. Same, yeah, same with my brother.
Speaker 2:No.
Speaker 1:I knew Barney. I just I don't really recall much. Can you sing the clean up song? Is that like, clean up, clean up everybody, everybody everywhere. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, okay, so, yeah. So she was on Barney and Friends, and little did anyone know that this child star is later going to become not only a pop sensation and an acclaimed actress, but also a powerful voice for mental health awareness. So let's get into Selena Gomez's career and her rise to fame. So she continued to rise as she transitioned into her teenage years In 2007, at 15, she landed the lead role of Alex Russo in the Disney Channel series Wizards of Waverly Place. The show's immense popularity catapulted her into teen idol status, bringing with it a lot of pressure. At a young age, wizards of Waverly Place was the fucking bomb. So good, so good. In 2007, I graduated high school, but it was so Disney Channel. Watch it for life.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So, as her acting career flourished, she also ventured into music. In 2009, she formed a pop rock band, selena Gomez and the Scene, releasing three successful studio albums, and then she had her transition to a solo artist in 2013 with her album Stars Dance, and that solidified her status as a pop superstar. So, while her career was soaring behind the scenes, she was grappling with mounting health issues. In 2013, at the age of 21, she was diagnosed with lupus, an autoimmune disease that can affect various parts of the body, and this diagnosis marked the beginning of a challenging journey that would intertwine her physical and mental health.
Speaker 1:In January 2014, she made the decision that surprised many fans she secretly checked into a rehab facility in Arizona for two weeks. At the time, speculation ran rampant about potential substance abuse issues. However, she later revealed that this stay was related to her lupus diagnosis and the toll it was taking on her overall health. I could have had a stroke, selena said in an interview with Billboard, addressing the rumors I wanted so badly to say you guys have no idea. I'm in chemotherapy. You're assholes. I locked myself away until I was confident and comfortable again. I remember this, too. I remember these rumors. When she checked in, I remember thinking substance abuse and whatnot, because that was what was in my face. Of course they lead with that before they lead with mental health. Of course, of course.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:So as her career continued to ascend, so did the pressure. In 2016, she was forced to cancel the remainder of her revival world tour to focus on her mental health. The decision came after she had been struggling with anxiety and panic attacks and depression and all those side effects she attributed to her lupus. She said tours are a really lonely place for me. My self-esteem was shot, I was depressed, anxious. I started to have panic attacks right before getting on stage or right after leaving the stage. So, following the tour cancellation, she checked into a treatment facility in Tennessee for 90 days. The extended stay marked a turning point in her approach to mental health. During this time, she engaged in various types of therapy individual sessions, group therapy and even equine therapy. We love horse therapy.
Speaker 2:Just like I mentioned, I know and you're- not sure, the ancient. Greeks or whatever.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So she said it was one of the hardest things I've done, but it was the best thing I've done. She told Vogue this about her time in treatment and then, in the summer of 2017, she underwent a kidney transplant due to complications with her lupus. Her close friend, an actress, francia Reza, was the donor. I don't know if I said her last name right, but I want to say Reza, it's Raisa.
Speaker 2:I don't recall, but you added an accent, so I'm not sure if that's offensive or culturally accurate.
Speaker 1:I think it might be. I think it's accurate, I think it's appropriate. Okay, well, it's coming from a good place. While the surgery was successful and moved her lupus into remission, the emotional toll of the experience was significant, and just over a year later, she experienced what many describe as an emotional breakdown. She was hospitalized twice for a low white blood cell count, a common side effect for kidney transplant patients. During this time, friends of Selena described her as despondent and emotional. They described her as paranoid and unrecognizable, and all of this suggested a possible psychotic break. So this led Selena Gomez to seek treatment at an East Coast psychiatric facility, and it was during this period that she received a diagnosis that would change her life bipolar disorder.
Speaker 1:In April 2020, during an Instagram live session with Miley Cyrus for Cyrus's Bright Minded series, selena Gomez publicly revealed her bipolar disorder diagnosis for the first time. This is her sharing on the show. Recently, I went to one of the best mental hospitals in America McLean Hospital and I discussed that after years of going through a lot of different things, I realized I was bipolar Now. This diagnosis was a turning point for her. She said once she has information, it actually helps me, it doesn't scare me once I know it. So this newfound understanding became the foundation for her mental health advocacy work. Since her diagnosis, she's been more open about her mental health journey in her Apple TV documentary Selena Gomez, my mind and me that came out in 2022. Fucking awesome. I highly recommend you watch it. It's so real, but she provides insight into living with bipolar disorder. The film shows her experiencing both manic and depressive episodes and illustrating the cyclical nature of the condition. Selena Gomez also mentioned experiencing psychosis during a manic episode, which led her to spend time in a treatment facility. She described the experience as hearing voices and becoming paranoid, which are common symptoms of severe manic episodes and bipolar. She shared all of this, which I fucking think is awesome, like down to the fucking T. I just love it. I love it so much.
Speaker 1:So today, selena Gomez continues to manage her bipolar disorder and lupus while maintaining a successful career in music and acting, and in 2019, she was presented with the McLean Award for Mental Health Advocacy from McLean Hospital. She received this award for her openness about her own mental health journey, and then in 2022, she received the Morton E Rutterman Award in Inclusion from the Rutterman Family Foundation, recognizing her efforts to raise mental health awareness and expand access to services for young people. And that same year, the Stanford Healthcare Innovation Lab honored her with the Mental Health Innovations Menti Award for Excellence in Mental Health Advocacy. And additionally, because this girl she's just out here, she's out here advocating, she's crushing it, I know. Additionally, in 2023, she was included in the Very Well Mind 25, and that's an award that recognizes individuals making significant contributions to mental health awareness. So these accolades they just highlight her impactful role in destigmatizing mental health issues and promoting open conversations about mental well-being.
Speaker 1:She also has a makeup line Rare Beauty. I love this woman. Her makeup line is called Rare Beauty. She established the Rare Impact Fund, committing to raise $100 million over 10 years to increase access to mental health services. She's also been open about her ongoing therapy and she credits dialectical behavior therapy, dbt, with changing her life. This is just a little side note that I like to say. Dbt is a very good therapy practice for people with bipolar and for, like, intense mood disorders. So that's something. Yeah, it provides us with really good tools. So Selena Gomez's journey with mental health is going to be ongoing, as we know, but her openness about her struggles have made a very significant impact so far, and I can only imagine what they're going to do. By sharing her story, she continues to inspire millions, proving that it's possible to live a full and productive life while managing mental health conditions. That's the story that I put together for Selena Gomez, and learning about her journey, I knew some of that because I read headlines.
Speaker 2:But that's interesting. I didn't know she was ever diagnosed with bipolar.
Speaker 1:You know me, I like to do bipolar stories, but I yeah, she was eventually diagnosed with bipolar and the one once you could label it like what she says, like once she knows more about it, it doesn't scare her anymore. So it's like once you label it, you kind of like attack it. It can be proactive. But I like, when I was putting together the story, like I could kind of see like through the hospitalizations and everything that she was going through, like you don't have a label, like oh, like what is this Like? Is this lupus, is this anxiety, is this, is this depression? Like what the fuck is going on. So when it's like, oh, I could put this on it and all of that stems from this, like that's gotta be empowering and yeah, she shares it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, which is brave in and of itself.
Speaker 1:She shares a lot of it like a lot, like all of this information is real. It's wild. Like this is all of her talking and just you know showing up. She shows up for the community.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think that's fantastic, and especially in the spotlight, this could have a negative effect on her because mental health is still somewhat stigmatized. So it's I mean, and I I still see her getting acting jobs and you know, doing all of that. So, yeah, I think she is just making it. She already made it in life.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, yeah, selena Gomez, that's what's up. Our Disney princess, wizards of waverly place, even stevens she wasn't in it. I'm just naming disney shows now. Yeah, I know I was like what? The frick and even stevens was my favorite. Lizzie mcguire, oh my god. Oh. Disney shows back in the day were fucking epic.
Speaker 2:They were so good, sweet life okay, that's enough of that, let's jump into our book. Tell me, what book are we reading? Unpluck your Brain by Faith G Harper, phd. And funny enough that you mentioned DBT, but chapter five is getting professional help treatment options, and right off the bat, number one that she mentions traditional talk therapy. Freaking love it, not specifically DBT, but like talk therapy and she has them in here.
Speaker 1:She has different ones. She starts out with traditional talk therapy and she says this is my jam. Yeah, we love, we practice.
Speaker 2:We do Love, love love, love, love therapy.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we love, we practice.
Speaker 2:We do Love, love, love, love, love, therapy.
Speaker 1:It's good for you, it's good for me. So there's something in here that she said that I highlighted. If you're looking for a therapist, you want to work with someone that is licensed. Life coaches and other certified professionals and the like can do amazing work but likely don't have the training and resources to help you through the more intense emotional work that a therapist does. Now, I highlighted this because I have a I guess you could put her in the category of life coach that I've been seeing for a decade now and she, she, when she hits her limit, she tells me she's like you need to go learn these skills.
Speaker 1:Like she told me, like you need to go learn DBT. She's like I am not, you know, I do not do that, I am not like capable of doing that. I'm not going to say anything along those lines Like that, would you know a diagnosis or things like that. So she always, like recognizes her limits and like when it's gone too far and she's like, okay, you need this. Like I can only motivate because she motivates me, she's like where I go to and I get regrounded and like puts my like, my feet back on the ground. I'm like I totally get it I could fucking do this.
Speaker 1:Like she knows me, she's telling me what I could do. I just I fucking love her, but then sometimes she'll be like you need to work this out. This has to go deeper. You need a bipolar specialist, mood specialist, something like that. So I have, I've reached out to them.
Speaker 1:So, yeah, I just wanted to make that point because, yeah, people can get confused and also it's fucking I mean, it can be when you're looking at like doing therapy, like sometimes you go with like okay, the expensive option is always going to be like the PhD, it's always going to be the psychiatrist, the psychologist. But then there's these other options you could see like other other people counselors, life coaches, you could see them but they're they're a lot cheaper. So if someone's like going to approach therapy, you know they might go with the cheaper option, like I just did this. I just found a therapist in psychology today that does dbt and it specializes in mood disorders and trauma. So and she literally says in here she talks about trauma and finding somebody with a trauma certificate and like that's literally like this woman and she says you could, they have them in their websites.
Speaker 1:That's literally what I did. This woman's thing said all of that. I was on the phone with her for maybe like two minutes and I was like this is the woman I want to start talking to. Like she seems like she knows her shit. Anyway, I talked a lot there. I guess this is my talk therapy.
Speaker 2:Of course it is, and it's free. My therapist has a master's, so I mean it doesn't need to be a PhD, but she's still like licensed.
Speaker 1:I think she's a family and marriage counselor or something I was thinking about getting into family, marriage therapy counseling Like you yourself, as a profession yeah, when I was younger, because I had the psychology degree, so I was like oh, I think you meant now no, I was like you could do MFT marriage and family therapy. You could do that without getting a full PhD, so that's why I was interested in it.
Speaker 2:She has a master's. I love her. She knows like tools and I I'm doing it just for me, so it's not like family or marriage, but I love her Well not like like her tools she gives are great.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so allopathic meds.
Speaker 2:So mainstream treatment.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean anxiety meds, depression meds, I think can be very useful in getting you to a place where you can use the talk therapy tools. I think so too, but yeah, they have to go together Like medicine can?
Speaker 1:I think so too, but yeah, they have to go together. Like medicine can only take you so far.
Speaker 2:Like you have to do, like you have to do the work where you have to work on other things together with it.
Speaker 1:The tools yeah, it's so much she goes into naturopathic meds. I've done this.
Speaker 2:What have you done?
Speaker 1:I've done these. What have you done? I've tried, I've done these, the herbs, all sorts of foods I was doing. She was a biofeedback specialist or I don't know how she phrased it, so I don't know like remember biofeedback, like you hold that like metal thing and like the the conductor goes like this I, I don't know, we did it in psychology it's kind of like clear, like a-.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, it's like that. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, I remember that.
Speaker 1:Scientology. Yeah, so it's that. So she essentially would put like I would hold it and then she would put like something on my chest and see, like how my body responded to it by seeing, like if she could push my muscle out of my hand, like push it away from my body, and then she would like count the whispers, like I would hear her counting, and then she would come up with like a whole plan like what I should eat and what I should do.
Speaker 2:In the book. Back to the book other complementary therapies acupressure, acupuncture you've done that right. Yeah, I've done everything. And it's wildressure, acupuncture, you've done that right?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I've done everything and it's mild. Yes, acupuncture, Justin, my acupuncture. That's crazy that you remember their name, what? Well, it was one dude and I would go to his practice and he would. Just like you know, I'm a vibe. We exchanged a lot of information about each other.
Speaker 1:I was there for my stomach and my migraines. And then like, at first, that's what I went for. And then he learned that I have depression and anxiety. Like my mom was like tell him, just tell him what's going on, he could probably help you. And he was like, why did? He was literally like why have you never told me this? And then he started putting like needles in different spots, made my headaches go away, my stomach stopped hurting as well. Wow, yeah, but at that point in time I wasn't really measuring the variables in my mental health. I was very young but yeah, I did the acupuncture thing. Justin was awesome.
Speaker 2:That's kind of cool. I kind of have wanted to try Needles freak me out, but I heard it's not really painful or anything.
Speaker 1:No, every now and then it'll hit a snag. It'll be like, oh, like a ping. It's usually like right between your thumb and your pointer finger in the mushy area, because they go there every no, no, but like you end up having like five in your ears and you won't even feel it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I have wanted to try it though, but yeah, I'm not sure if it's usually covered by insurance, so I'm always like, oh, maybe not, what does?
Speaker 1:she say about it. Well, it's definitely. It works with the vagus nerve system.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean it works by stimulating certain points on the body to promote healing and or reduce pain. So with these complimentary therapies the author is saying like these therapies aren't designed to diagnose or treat these conditions, they're meant to just kind of support the body's like natural way of healing. So I like her.
Speaker 1:I like what she says about acupuncture. She's basically saying well, I guess I guess that bullshit fucking works. There's like there's something to it. Like you know, she doesn't seem like she could put her finger on it, but she's like there's something to it. Yeah, let's move on to the next one. That one's a good one.
Speaker 2:Yeah, oh, my gosh Massage. I love massage. I get them quite frequently. I love a relaxing massage, Don't get me wrong, but I carry a lot of my tension in my shoulders. I ask them to like work on my shoulders and there'll be a knot and she'll just go over and over and over and it's kind of painful. But then, like afterwards, you're just like okay, like okay that that feels good.
Speaker 1:Sometimes the pain sticks with you and like you're sore the next day, you're like jesus, what the fuck did they do? But I'm the same way like when I go into massage. I'm just like, listen, you have my money. Like I'm here, I'm here to get it to work.
Speaker 1:Like like work on me like get it done, like I know, I know where my shit hurts and but I'm like you. I them frequently I think more than the average person and they say it's really good. They say it's really good you move your muscles. Get move around that lactic acid.
Speaker 2:Yeah, they always say after a massage they're like drink a lot of water.
Speaker 1:Yeah, she says massages function as a reset of the nervous system. Especially like after trauma, we feel disconnected from our bodies, so they realize that massage can be very triggering for certain types of trauma. That's interesting. Well, I guess, yeah, we store trauma in our body. God, we're fucking wild, like our brain, our mind, our psyche, our bodies it's all connected.
Speaker 2:It's such a twisted web.
Speaker 1:Yeah, like the thoughts in your brain can cause you to have diarrhea. Like that's nuts, like it's nuts.
Speaker 2:I mean, I feel like there's more than just that, but yes. Yeah.
Speaker 1:You know, like when you have like I like, for a while I had really bad, like heightened anxiety, like I was puking, like often, like I would like have to run to the bathroom and I would just puke up bile, and it was just like, kelly, are you pregnant? I was like no, I'm not fucking pregnant, I'm just puking. And, yeah, it came from fucking nervousness and just anxiety. The things we can do to our body. Oh, do you do chiropractic? Do you do chiropractic?
Speaker 2:treatment? No, for a time I was thinking about it because my lower back hurts so badly, but then I realized it was like the way I was like laying down and better something. It was like something that I could easily fix.
Speaker 2:So then I was like eh, but no, I've heard a friend of mine is a runner and she would have to go in high school when she was like in cross country or track or whatever to like get her let her hips realigned. But it was like some type of something she's like it would be painful, like a quick pain, but then it would feel so good and she said it works. But I have no personal experience.
Speaker 1:With the chiropractor. You'd never gone to one. Nope, my mom had me going to one since I was a baby, so I was like one of those babies on the table getting adjusted.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, that's so cute, so I yeah, where I grew up that was like a maybe a two week thing. I don't think it was a, maybe it was a weekly thing, cause he was right at the neighborhood across across the road. But yeah, it was interesting. I get all the time when I was younger and then when I moved away, I never kept up that practice.
Speaker 1:It's fucking expensive. It's not covered by insurance, like I mean, I'm not, I'm not knacking it Like it's good, like a lot of people go, it's wonderful, great, you know, but I don't have time for it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, If insurance doesn't cover even a chunk of it, it's hard to like. Oh, maybe I try something else.
Speaker 1:Oh fuck, I forgot that there's biofeedback in here and neurofeedback. That's what she did, that's what that doctor did, as well as the natural supplements too. Sorry, I just skipped ahead to another treatment, but I do want to touch on energy healing, reflexology and Reiki. She says it's something that seems super weird even to her, but then she read about it and tried it for herself. She says wow, it's based on the idea that our bodies operate on all these frequencies that we could tap into to promote our healing. So I did this.
Speaker 1:I went to a shaman. Of course you did. What is my life? I'm literally. I love going through this right now. So I went to a shaman and she did a bunch of energy around me, like with the stick you know, like did my whole intake, all sorts of things. I was there for probably like two hours on her table. She'd stand me up, She'd stretch me out, like move my arms to different places. Yeah, Very interesting experience. I personally did not get anything from it. Maybe she wasn't a true shaman, I don't know, but nothing really came of it. That like cleared my mind. My mom swears by her. My mom will go to her and be like ah, ah, ah. And I'm just like okay, like you know, that's your practice, then it's just, it's not mine.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I've had a Reiki I want to say Reiki massage, but maybe it's Reiki healing before it was years ago. I didn't get much from it either, but I kind of wonder if it's one of those things, almost like therapy, where you have to go and you almost have to like not get into it, but like you have to become an active participant in it, because you know if therapy, if you just like show up and you're like this isn't working, this isn't working, that's kind of what I wonder. I don't know, though. I've only done it once. But yeah, for me, for Reiki, I was just laying there and I like would peek, open my eyes and be like what's happening? Like is she?
Speaker 2:still in the room.
Speaker 1:Like I need to know, Like open your eyes and just hands are like in your face.
Speaker 2:Well, I feel like heat on my face, like am I about to die? I'm like then I'd see your hands are close to my face. So, yeah, I think maybe if we tried these things more frequently we'd be like more in tune. I don't know. To be perfectly honest, I just can't afford to try, yeah, but I know some people really benefit from them. So it is, yeah, another type of complementary treatment. Did you want to cover the biofeedback neurofeedback, alpha stim treatment?
Speaker 1:yeah, I mean, I read the biofeedback like, yeah, I talked about earlier, I did that. She would put things on me and be like, okay, this, this natural supplement, this food, things like that, and decide what my treatment plan was. Neurofeedback that focuses specifically on the brain signals, with the same intent to help individuals learn to manage their brain responses. So I don't really know if I've had neurofeedback therapy or something along those lines. There's also alpha stim treatment. I've never heard of that. Have you heard of that? No, I hadn't heard of it before this chapter. So alpha stems are designed to increase alpha brainwaves, which are the great combination of calm and alert that we all share. She says. She says it works like neurofeedback, except the machine does the work for you rather than training that brain.
Speaker 2:State yourself, that's interesting, yeah she says the author uses alpha stim in her practice but it causes a lot of tough therapy day hangovers.
Speaker 1:So so they're, they're a prescription, like there's something they're like yeah, interesting yeah, huh, I've never heard of that before, ever. Yeah, let me talk about nutrition changes. That's something that I've always heard. Your gut is connected to your brain. A healthy gut will help.
Speaker 2:We've talked about that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, will help your brain, will help more, will benefit other areas of your body. So nutrition is a huge deal. She says that I know there's lots of nutrition wars out, wars out there and figuring out the best plan can be exhausting Paleo, vegan, gluten free the fuck am I supposed to eat? So it's just basically, she just tells us to eat the healthy foods and just take care of it. Any diet you follow is going to make you more mindful of what you're putting in your mouth, and that's honestly true.
Speaker 1:When I did, I did whole 30 and I did it for more than a month because I ended up loving it. So what it is, it's essentially like you can only eat like foods that have nothing, like you have to look at the ingredients, like they have to have no sugar, I don't know a bunch of shit. Basically, it's a one sheeter that you could take to the grocery store and everything on that sheet is what you're allowed to buy. I love that part of it. But I did that. I did that for probably two months and I was so intentional about what I put in my body like, so intentional, like I felt super healthy, like I was proud of myself, like I got a decaf coffee with oat, milk and honey, like like I was like I would never drink that before but like it, you know it was just yeah, it was very intentional.
Speaker 2:It makes you feel good. It felt good, I believe it. Food really can change a lot. Then she goes into peer supports. So peer-to-peer support partners help people with their wellness, which makes a lot of sense where there's like a lot of groups out there or communities of people suffering from similar symptoms, similar diseases, where you can get that peer support. And I think just that connection alone really helps people to not feel alone and not feel like I'm the only one suffering to have that support.
Speaker 2:If you're having a hard day, you have somebody to reach out to.
Speaker 1:So I think that's extremely valuable, because I just started attending groups. I'm trying to find someone who has similar experiences to me that I could listen to or speak on. That hasn't come across yet, but I'm being patient. I'm being patient, yeah.
Speaker 2:It takes time to find a good match, a good support, a good sponsor, sponsor.
Speaker 1:She also talks about natural supports. So there's peer supports and natural supports, and natural supports are these are the people who love you just because you belong to them. So that means your family, your friends, teachers, coworkers, et cetera. These people go above and beyond their role in your life to support you getting better. So having people who love us just because they do is so important. And you know, some people don't have that, a lot of people don't have that. As I got older, I realized that and I have to like take that in. Like I, I have a privilege. You know I have a very nice family. I have like great friends that support me. That was a good chapter Treatment, yeah. And next week says this is your brain on life. Whoa, we're more than halfway through this book, yay.
Speaker 2:Yay, yay, yay Yay.
Speaker 1:Yay, I love it. We need to start figuring out what our next book is going to be. We should our next book should be something that isn't like a like cause. We did the how to do the work and that was very tool oriented and this one is very it's similar, but it's just like reframed. So we should do a story like the next one, like actually we should do a story within a story on this fucking podcast.
Speaker 2:Oh my gosh, let's get all meta.
Speaker 1:Okay, yeah, we should we should, but we'll figure it out. Maybe like a concept or something. We'll figure it out. Maybe like a concept or something, figure it out. Yeah, maybe science. We'll fucking get it. It'll be amazing. You will love it. Maybe you'll buy the book. You probably won't. I don't fucking blame you all right, so okay.
Speaker 2:Well, that's that I guess that's our, that's our podcast.
Speaker 1:Uh yeah, so go on apple. You're on apple right now. So good, okay, just go over and just leave like four. What is it? Four stars, five stars, just click the most stars.
Speaker 2:I don't know I have an Android, so if you're not on Apple, go into the Play Store or not the Play Store wherever you're listening to this podcast Give it as many stars as possible.
Speaker 1:Yeah, help us out, see, and that applies to everybody.
Speaker 2:So we don't just ostracize the apple versus the non-apple.
Speaker 1:But you could also follow us on Instagram. I'm not OKK podcast. Send us your emails about your two degrees. All right, not OKK podcast at gmailcom. Also, in the description of the episode, you can click the link to text us your two degrees and that will pop into our emails. And yeah, I think that's all she wrote.
Speaker 2:As they say, Cool, that is all she wrote. Well, thanks for listening and joining us.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and remember, when you're here, you're never alone. Bye, bye, bye.
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