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We appreciate you!
Follow us on Instagram @imnotokkpodcast
Email us at notokkpodcast@gmail.com
We appreciate you!
Hey, I'm Kelly Kranz and I'm Kimberly, and welcome to the I'm Not OKK podcast. Hi, we are living it up. We are living our best lives. That's a lie. We're living lives. Yeah, I was going to say we're living our best.
Speaker 2:No, no, it's that thing where it's like I'm not thriving, I'm surviving, you know, mm-hmm, mm-hmm.
Speaker 1:Mm-hmm, that's the vibe, that's the vibe. That's the vibe. We're podcasting and we're surviving and we're not thriving. Kimberly, why, why, what.
Speaker 2:We're attempting to thrive, but we're not there yet, we're not even close. We're like what's just like plateauing we're we're trying to strive to plateau.
Speaker 1:What is? If you're just gonna just drive to plateau, we're gonna cross country ski I don't. I don't know where your train of mind went with that, but sure, okay, I'll just go along on, like up on like a flat area, right, right, like, yeah, like everything else is going to plateau and just fall flat, like we could cross-country ski across that flat shit.
Speaker 2:Okay, there's a lot of flat things you could be like I'm going to roll a ball across a table.
Speaker 1:I heard the earth is flat.
Speaker 2:Oh, don't even start. Oh my gosh. Different podcast, Definitely a different podcast.
Speaker 1:I would like if that was true, I'd be like oh my gosh. Yeah, if that was one of my real beliefs, we wouldn't be. You probably wouldn't be having this podcast with me if that was one of my real beliefs.
Speaker 2:Oh my god, oh my god if it was one of your real beliefs, I would have to think about it. I'd have have to be like, okay, kelly is educated, this might just be a thing that's like. You know, one time she, I don't know. I can't think of a good reason, but I wouldn't judge you solely on that, thank you.
Speaker 1:I appreciate it. Do you know what the listeners can't see?
Speaker 2:Our beautiful faces.
Speaker 1:That they are something to look at, but our cute little doggies.
Speaker 2:These inanimate.
Speaker 1:I don't need squishy doggies, we have yeah, they're like little squishy doggies that, like little kids, get out of packs out of gas stations, and we have the same ones, so now they're accessories on our microphones.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but let's say where we got ours, cause I got mine as a bonus when I bought three slimes from an Etsy shop.
Speaker 1:So, oh well, she got that from a gas station, cause I got mine from there.
Speaker 2:Oh well, wow, it came in like a package.
Speaker 1:It was just like a package. You just open it up and there was two in there, but they probably saw them and it's like you could buy them in bulk anywhere. They're just little squishies. Can you even call these squishies? I don't think kids call these squishies.
Speaker 2:You can squish them.
Speaker 1:Who's a little. Depression doggie. Who's a little?
Speaker 2:depression doggy. Who's a little depression, doggy, you're a depression doggy. Oh, my goodness, Okay, yeah, it's our mascot now. Mm-hmm, that and just sadness.
Speaker 1:Summertime sadness it's on the way.
Speaker 2:Yeah, actually. So do you ever get wind? Warnings's a thing that you yeah, you guys get hurricanes okay, yeah, we get wind warnings because we're going to get one with winds up to 45 miles per hour. I guess I'm like guess who's has a valid excuse to stay indoors this girl.
Speaker 1:You do need a valid excuse to stay indoors, but it helps to have one.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it does, because it's like, oh, could I go outside and take a walk? No, the government or the weather, people are telling me stay indoors.
Speaker 1:the government is telling me to stay inside the the weather. People who are government workers, are they yeah, are they not?
Speaker 2:I don't know the Postal.
Speaker 1:Service and the government. No, that's another podcast, okay, so do you remember last week we were talking?
Speaker 2:about Barely.
Speaker 1:I know, right, we were talking about doing, shifting things two degrees, like doing small things that we can. That'll make us feel better about ourselves, things that we like you know we don't have to eat the whole, the whole pizza at once. You could just have a slice, did you do yours? Mine was to. I said I was going to take Effie out, my dog, and and take her for a walk. I did that twice.
Speaker 2:Crushing it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean it's more than I've done it recently in a lot of time. So yeah, I did a little two degrees shift. I'd like to continue to do it, to take her out every day, at least once a day, but going outside is full of anxiety.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and it's work.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it is work too. The second I'm outside and I'm doing it. I'm mad, but I'm happy at the same time. But I'm mad why?
Speaker 2:are you?
Speaker 1:mad. Because I'm mad, because I'm like fucking had to push myself to get out there. And then I'm out there and I'm like well, now that I'm here, what else can I be doing? That's not here.
Speaker 2:I never actually think that when I go on a walk, that's weird yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:You're just like the entire time just loathing. It Like I could be napping right now.
Speaker 1:Something like that. It's like I can enjoy it, and then I just I can. I'm enjoying it, but not enjoying it at the same time how fascinating yeah, it is fascinating.
Speaker 1:It might have something to do with my dog. She likes to like bark at people, no, like bite people and like and then like go after other dogs. So walking isn't necessarily relaxing to do with her. So I always, I always have like a pet, like aerosol, just like spray, that can like startle her, like in my pocket, and I just have to walk with my head on a swivel and if dogs are coming at us, you know I have to turn around and walk the other way and then there could be a dog coming around that corner. Listen, right now this is so boring to listen to. I'm so sorry, kimberly, how was your two degrees?
Speaker 2:Thanks for asking, and anytime people talk about dogs I'm interested. So I was interested but whatever my two degrees, I didn't really do because it was like to kind of be present, to like pet Walter and be present in the moment. I actually went, took Walter for a walk two times too in the past week and one time I realized I was just like kind of present. I was like there we were walking. I don't listen to music or anything like that on my walks and Walter he eats things like there was like a pizza crust and you know I have to watch out for that because he'll eat it or whatever.
Speaker 1:I thought you were going to say like he's out there eating pine cones like every little bit, because there's dogs like that.
Speaker 2:Oh no, but he does go in my backyard and eats rabbit poop. Meanwhile I'm buying him insanely expensive dog food because I want him to like be healthy. I'm like, oh, my partner hates it. He's like, why are you spending so much money? He literally eats garbage. I'm like you don't get it, like he is my soul dog, but yeah, so I kind of did the two degrees, kind of yeah. Did like one degree or two degrees, in a different way.
Speaker 1:It popped up, it appeared it took advantage of the situation. So what you know, the walking, yeah, I mean, we can't not count it. We did things that we said that we were going to do in some capacity. Now the hard part is just being like not mad that it didn't happen, like every single fucking day, because that's where it's like, oh well, I only did it fucking once, I did it yesterday and I'm supposed to do it again today, but I didn't do it today. So now I feel guilty. And then it goes in a circle and it doesn't stop.
Speaker 2:Well, that's 360 degrees, yes, yes, that's true, and we're just trying to go two degrees, yeah so I mean, yeah, we don't do it every day, but that's why it's like a two degree change, not a 180 yeah well, you know well, I want to do another one because I want to like keep this going on the pod.
Speaker 1:I think I'm gonna continue to do that shit with my dog because I definitely need to take her out more, walk your dog. I need to walk my dog. I definitely need to take her out more, and I think my other like, and I don't know if this counts as two degrees or not, but I think I might not sleep on the couch anymore.
Speaker 2:Whoa new sofa, new life.
Speaker 1:Yes, I got a new sofa, new life for my glasses. It doesn't know me like that, like the other sofa did. Someone picked it up, it got in the car. I waved goodbye. I was like, oh goodbye, it's pretty sad, it's pretty sad.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that can be emotional. Fuck that sofa.
Speaker 1:But anyway, that's going to be my two degrees. I was going to try my best to, and maybe it might not be all nights this week. Coming week it could be maybe just a few nights, but that'd be a win.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's the two degrees. Well, good for you. I think I'm going to try and eat a meal at mealtimes because that is hard for me where I'll like eat a snack, and then it will be eight o'clock and I'll be like oh, I'm hungry for food and it's like why didn't I eat at a normal time? Or why did I like eating cake doesn't count as a meal, you know. So I think it's just eating decent food around meal times.
Speaker 1:That's going to be my two degrees. Do you eat any meals in general?
Speaker 2:yes, I'm a human being.
Speaker 1:I have to eat food, kelly I have noticed you, you know, over the past couple of months per se eat different things that aren't like I'm like. I see you eat around the meal times and they're not meals. So when are you eating your meals? That's what I wanted to say.
Speaker 2:Not around mealtimes. It took me a while to get that out. Yeah, that was hard to understand it was, but I eat meals. I ate mac and cheese in front of you the other day. That's a meal.
Speaker 1:That's true. We were both eating meals together. Yeah, we're talking. I was eating some type of rice thing with steak in it. Oh, that sounds good. It was leftover. I love leftovers.
Speaker 2:But see, I eat meals, okay, okay, feeling a lot of judgment.
Speaker 1:Sorry, I never mean to judge. Good, do you know, I've always judged. I'm always like what are you eating now?
Speaker 2:and you're like this snack is just like yes, yes yeah, I normally show you the bowl and it looks terrible you're just like, oh, okay whatever, I live my life, I live, live my life, yep.
Speaker 1:That's cool. That's a good two degrees, so try and do that at least a few times. Thanks, girl yeah.
Speaker 2:So I'm really excited. Let's jump right into my story. Jump, jump, jump. Okay, yeah, bring that energy with you. So I will be looking at music and mental health. Oh, very cool, Very cool, and how they coincide, so the sources are psychiatryorg, verywellmindcom, harvardedu, jedfoundationorg and verywellmind. So before I get into anything, kelly, what is your favorite genre of music? I will list them. Is it pop, rap, hip-hop, country rock, heavy metal, indie, dance, classical or jazz, blues and soul.
Speaker 1:Pop, rap and hip-hop. I think some indie in there. You have to choose one, oh one. Well, I guess the most I gravitate towards is pop.
Speaker 2:Okay. So they say that your music genre says something about you, so you chose pop. I like pop too. It says extroverted, honest and conventional. Okay.
Speaker 1:The fuck is conventional. What the fuck is conventional about me? Yeah, I know that's incorrect. I just got offended, I got so offended.
Speaker 2:Okay, that's a weird thing to get offended to. Although pop music lovers were hardworking and had high self-esteem, researchers suggest that they are less creative and more uneasy than those enamored by other musical styles, so I'm not sure that's actually you.
Speaker 1:It literally just called me basic yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, rap fans tended to have high self-esteem and were generally more outgoing than fans of other styles. And then you said indie.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but not like deep indie, but like you know, like that folksy, I like some folksy stuff, okay well, I'll just do indie.
Speaker 2:Fans of the indie genre registered as introverted, intellectual and creative, but less hardworking and gentle than fans of other styles. Passivity, anxiousness and low self-esteem were other notable personality characteristics.
Speaker 1:So what, what.
Speaker 2:Anyway, so let's keep going. I just thought that was interesting, that sometimes your music genre can actually say stuff about you. It's almost like you're a horoscope.
Speaker 1:I have a question. Okay, yes, what is the Taylor Swift music genre say about someone?
Speaker 2:It says we shouldn't talk about it. Okay, she doesn't have a genre.
Speaker 1:She went from country to pop.
Speaker 2:I can't.
Speaker 1:We can't get into this. You can't do it, you will geek out too much.
Speaker 2:This podcast will take three hours. I will leave.
Speaker 1:We can't Continue with your story.
Speaker 2:Taylor Swift is my job. No, that's what Anyway? So first benefit of music is it has been shown to heal trauma through music therapy. So there's been numerous studies about this, how music therapy has shown promise in providing a safe and supportive environment for people who are suffering from trauma and trying to heal and building resilience. It also decreases anxiety levels and improves functioning of depressed individuals and it's actually evidence-based, which is pretty cool that they've done the studies. It's evidence backs it that music helps people through these traumas. So I really love that because it's not like oh, is it when it's okay, this might help. It's actually being used. So musical therapy is an established healthcare profession that uses evidence-based music interventions to address the health goals. Really.
Speaker 1:So I'm sorry, it's an actual, I guess. Yeah, like I could sign up with a doctor and do music therapy.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm not sure if your insurance will cover it, but I think yeah.
Speaker 1:I didn't realize. I called the front desk. Well.
Speaker 2:I'm not going to be like, yeah, you could do it, and then it costs you like two grand because your insurance is like no, so I'm always thinking about that insurance. Are you kidding me? Need that deductible. But it happens between patient, obviously, and family or caregivers can be there as well. And then a board certified music therapist, which is pretty cool, and you have to complete undergrad and graduate music therapy program. So pretty intense, it's a pretty big deal, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:So there's a number of things that can be done. They have active, so like active music therapy where you can the patient can like sing, play an instrument, write a song, movement, digital music creation, just like anything that involves music. And then there's also more of the receptive side where it's like you listen to music, guided imagery with music playlist creation, music conversation. So there's two different worlds that you can kind of go in, but it's not just like you sit in a room and like listen to music, like it's like there is. You know more to it than that, but still the fact that music is this thing that helps people through is pretty cool. So in these processes they create goals to improve health and well-being, and these goals could be to decrease anxiety, shift mood, decrease pain perception during cancer or other medical treatments which is kind of crazy, increasing expression, finding motivation, those kinds of things and overall just improving your quality of life. So it's kind of cool that they're doing it to each situation, because each situation is unique, but music helps just improve your life. That's just crazy that this one thing that isn't medicinal isn't, you know, whatever it's music that you listen to every day actually can really help.
Speaker 2:So that's one thing music therapy. It can also help with stress, which I feel like a lot of people already know about, where it's like you listen to your favorite music and it kind of just brings you into a different world. But there was a study done where some people listened to relaxing music, others listened to the sound of rippling water, and then another group had, no, weren't listening to any music, and then they were presented like a stressful situation or a stress test or whatever, and the result was that listening to music had an impact on human stress response, particularly the autonomic nervous system. So those who listened to music like, regardless of what kind tended to recover more quickly following a stressor. So people who listened to that like water or like calming music, actually were able to handle the stress better or didn't become as stressed, which is so cool. So it can also improve motivation, which I just think of Eye of the Tiger when I think of motivation, where it's just like that gets you going and this even said like listening to music when you exercise.
Speaker 2:I have that certain playlist that just there's like I know there's playlists out there where it keeps in mind the beat of the song to how fast you should run during that time, so like you can keep up and stuff. It's pretty cool but it's like, yeah, that makes sense. So one experiment designed to investigate this, like music and improving motivation, had 12 healthy male students cycle at self-paced speeds. There were three trials. They biked for 25 minutes at a time and they listened to a playlist of six different popular songs of various tempos, so unknown to the listeners.
Speaker 2:The researchers made subtle differences to the music and measured performance 10%. So there's music at normal speed. And then there was, it increased by 10% and it decreased by 10%. Speeding up the tracks resulted in increased performance in terms of distance covered, the speed of pedaling and power exerted. Conversely, slowing down the music's tempo led to decreases and all those things. So music directly affected how well they performed, which is just so funny how subconsciously we keep up with this music. That's where even people who don't have. Well, your dad's a drummer, so you probably have music in you.
Speaker 1:You would think. Is that a no? Yeah, no, I'm not. No, I don't play music instruments or anything like that. Oh, mm-hmm, do you have good beat? Can you dance? Yeah, I could dance, I could hold a beat, mm-hmm, I could find the rhythm. I could find the rhythm.
Speaker 2:Okay, well, I've never seen you dance, so I'm not sure I 100% believe that. But okay, well, I've never seen you dance, so I'm not sure I 100% believe that. But okay, but it's just like people who don't have any rhythm or don't understand the beat, I still think innately we know the rhythmic whatever of a song. I feel like that's just our body, just like I don't know, I don't know how science works.
Speaker 1:Just vibing with vibrations energy.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean pretty much Just the energies. Yeah, yeah, it's kind of because I I'm a trained pianist. Well, I took piano lessons for many years.
Speaker 1:You're a trained. What now?
Speaker 2:Don't even get your mind out of the gutter. It's just so easy with that one.
Speaker 1:It's just so easy, it's so silly, it's so childish. I love it. How old are you to your guy? I don't know 12.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you're a 12-year-old boy, Say it again.
Speaker 2:No, I am not. I will not fulfill your fantasy, but ever since I was young I would tap along to songs and realize I was doing it. It would happen subconsciously because I'd keep the beat of the song, because that's the way I was kind of taught to keep the beat. So then you can play but still be on beat. So it's just like it's innate. Yes, it's a trained behavior, but I feel like other people have that it's just not as obvious, I don't know. Anyway, anyway, I digress, getting too jacked here, okay.
Speaker 1:Well, no think about all the chants and everything all through history like before, like instruments and stuff like that. That there was always some type of musical aspect, like people in coal mines like singing songs, chemical workers singing songs to get through the day Chemical workers.
Speaker 1:Yes, there's a few. My partner listens to all sorts of music and he has a few songs that are songs, or I call them chants, because I'm just like what is chanting in our house right now and he's like these are the chemical workers. Oh my gosh is a weird yeah music. So, yeah, it'll be like things along those lines of yeah, people, people are always like, yeah, music is just there, even when music isn't there. An instrument like, even if you can't sing, yeah people have been music.
Speaker 1:People have been music, been using music to get through so much, yeah, all of their lives.
Speaker 2:And it's also a form of like expression, like culturally. But just also there's been like what's it called? When you rebel, it can be like a protest song. You know, there's just so much you can do with music, Like in saying clown posse, I don't listen to them, I don don't know they're a whole posse.
Speaker 1:I don't actually know what they're all insane clowns. Yeah, no, like they dress up and they had and they put the clowns on their. They dress up with the clowns on their faces and their makeup and everything like that. Yeah yeah, I forget what their mission is exactly, but I don't think it's about scaring people, but yeah.
Speaker 2:Well, probably still happens. But okay, sure, anyway, I'll keep on moving. So it can also help improve mood. Music can make you happier. So once again, a study looked at reasons why people listen to music, and music played an important role in relating arousal and mood. So, okay, yeah, young child mind over there I'm making faces that you guys can't see. Yeah, because I said arousal Participants rated music's ability to help them achieve a better mood and become more self-aware as two of the most important functions of music, which I thought is interesting. You don't really think of becoming more self-aware when you listen to music.
Speaker 1:But it went from getting a boner to becoming self-aware.
Speaker 2:Okay, well, you put the I can't. No, we got to move away from arousal, okay. Another study found that intentionally trying to boost moods by listening to positive music could have an impact within two weeks. So in this study, the participants were told to purposely attempt to improve their mood by listening to positive music each day for two weeks. Other participants listened to music but were not told to become happier intentionally, so they're just like hey, go listen to music. And then the participants were asked to describe their own levels of happiness. Those who had intentionally tried to improve their moods reported feeling happier after just two weeks.
Speaker 2:So going into something like going into listening to music, you can be like I want to listen to this music to be happier. I'm like it can make you happier, I guess within two weeks, according to this study, but I'm not sure that's necessarily been tested a ton, so I'm not sure I'd 100% believe that. But just listening to music in general can make you happier, which is pretty cool, and going along with that, it can also improve depression, which I feel like kind of makes sense, because when you're sad and then you listen to a happier song or something, you're all in your head just in depression mode not mode, but you know what I mean and you listen to music and then you might start singing along or like you know. It kind of gets you out of that zone.
Speaker 1:I'll wake up in the morning and I know, if I ask Alexa to play my favorite songs that I have listed on Spotify, if I start playing music while I'm doing my morning routine, like you know, feeding all the cats and dog and all that shit I immediately like pep up and I start going and I feel really, really good. But because of my depression and because I know that that will help me, I refuse to ask Alexa to sing me happy music in the morning. It's just complete self-sabotage, like that.
Speaker 1:But there's also like a catharsis that comes with. Did I say catharsis, catharsisism, something that comes?
Speaker 2:with.
Speaker 1:Tharsis, yeah, yeah, yeah. And what I really like to do is if I'm upset and I'm really feeling the depression which is just constantly, always. But if I'm driving just blasting music from when I'm in middle school, just like fucking getting down to, like taking back Sunday Senses Fail, like Jimmy Eat World, just like Under Oath, just like screamo music, like I'm in my car, like, just like yes, like that. That just like feels so good. And then sometimes just have you ever turned on music and just done your own little like dance recital? No, yeah. So I highly recommend that because you move your body while you're listening to music.
Speaker 1:Basically, I started to do it when I saw all of the it's coming up again and you're going to dislike it. I started to do it when I saw all of the it's coming up again and you're going to dislike it. I started to do it when I saw all of these Taylor Swift reels of people who were doing her dance moves from her concert and they have like these blankets on and they're like throwing themselves, like they're just doing her actions that she was doing in her concert and I was like that's actually super fucking funny and it looks like a lot of fun. So I started doing that and you could just like hop all over your furniture and just like rock out to different things and it's just it's and it's fun. I do it when no one's home, obviously, because Larry would be like Dance like no one's watching.
Speaker 1:Yeah, larry, would be like get the fuck off the couch. Like what the fuck are you doing on the counter?
Speaker 2:I don't think it can be that judgmental. I mean, sometimes I dance, but lately I haven't. I used to dance in my kitchen. I'd turn on music when I lived at home, so this was high school. But when I'd bake my parents would be gone at a friend's or whatever and it'd be Friday night and I'd turn on the music and I'd bake and, like the dogs would be there so I'd kind of dance with my parents' dogs. It was so fun.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you get it. Yeah, Baking also. Baking and cooking always needs music. Always, Because they could just shimmy around the kitchen and I only again, I'm sorry, but you chose music. Again, she's my cooking music and my baking music she does, I'm sorry. Everything I cook and bake has a taste of T-Swift in it and that's what makes it more delicious, does it? Taste bitter?
Speaker 2:No, it doesn't taste bitter If I'm serving it to you, I'll make sure it tastes bitter. No, I actually do.
Speaker 1:There's no song that's named bitter or anything.
Speaker 2:No, because people have called her bitter, because she always sings about love lost and stuff.
Speaker 1:Oh well, my bitter bitch, my queen. That was a deep joke. Yeah, it was a deep cut.
Speaker 2:Anyway, anyway, I didn't even get it.
Speaker 1:Anyway, let's go, let's go.
Speaker 2:So improved depression. It can also help with social connection, which can also help with depression. But it can serve as a catalyst for social connection and support breaking down barriers and merging divides. It says that emerging evidence has said that the potential to enhance pro-social behavior, promote social connectedness and develop emotional competence. Music can serve as a catalyst for social connection and support breaking down barriers. I think that also kind of mixes into cultural can bridge cultural divides. Communities have also, as you've mentioned, in the past they've used it as a sense of belonging in a culture or I know, with slavery they had songs to keep their moods up but also to. Wasn't there the Underground Railroad there?
Speaker 1:was yeah, Wasn't there a song or something They'd?
Speaker 2:sing Mm-hmm, yeah. So I think it just connects people but also, in that case, sends messages that people don't actually know. So it's a great catalyst for connection, to spread culture. I mean because I know there's also cultural appropriation within music, but that's more on the artist side, not as a listener, but anyway.
Speaker 1:If you wanted to get into it. That's another podcast, yeah really so.
Speaker 2:There's a number of musicians that have mentioned mental health, like Adele, alanis Morissette, ariana Grande, billie Eilish. They've spoken out about their mental health. Like Adele, alanis Morissette, ariana Grande, billie Eilish They've spoken out about their mental health battles and suicidal ideation and having these artists who are creating this music. People can listen to this music and then feel more connected or feel heard. Or sometimes these musicians make songs in relation to those struggles or the mental health or that kind of thing. So it's nice to have that connection and know that even these people who are creating these great songs are going through this, also with the healing effects of music. So I guess musicians may be at a higher risk of mental health disorders. A recent survey of 1,500 independent musicians found that 73% have symptoms of mental illness, which I found that was interesting. But this could be due in part to the physical and psychological challenges of the profession. They found that musically active people have, on average, a higher genetic risk for depression and bipolar disorder. So that was interesting.
Speaker 2:But once again it's like okay, what are all the variables here? Like okay, I should be playing music. I mean, maybe, maybe you'd be great at it, but you never know. But it just like. I feel like if you start playing music, I don't think that's going to make you more depressed. If you try and become a musician and make that your profession, that might be harder and that might cause more mental strain. But I think we're not talking about becoming a musician, we're talking about just playing the piano to help your mood or that kind of thing. So I just thought that was interesting of note. Lastly, how can you benefit from music? The intervention that's been studied the most is listening, and this can be done with live or recorded music. It can be with intentional focus or just like that background noise type thing, oh like I love binaural beats.
Speaker 1:Has that come?
Speaker 2:up at all.
Speaker 1:Yes, I love binaural beats for focusing, like those different alpha waves, beta waves that they've identified that work in different and stimulate different areas of your brain, like when I at work, when I need to sit down and focus, like I'll just put that on in the background and 20 minutes later I'll be like well, damn, well, damn. You know it's not like taking an Adderall or anything like that, but it definitely calms most of my brain down and lets me focus on things that are important. But even meditating meditating to those brainwaves I really like those. Where do you find them? I find them on Spotify, spotify's got binaural beats.
Speaker 2:Binaural beats. I'll have to look into that because, yeah, I haven't actually tried that yet. I know you did that, but it actually works.
Speaker 1:It's worth a try, and they have them for deep sleep too. Just make sure you don't use the deep sleep one while you're trying to study or do work, because I was like one time. I was like, what's the difference? I figured out what the difference was real quick.
Speaker 2:Oh my gosh Nap time, I mean. At least it works Like that's a plus.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I know it works. I believe music can really change the state of mind. I really really do. So this is good. This is good shit. What?
Speaker 2:else you got Well, like I said. So listening to music you can also amplify your emotions. If you need a release, like, say, you really wanted a good cry, you could listen to some of T Swift's songs, whatever. So you can match your music to your current mood. But you can also which I think this is so interesting match your mood but then slowly change the feel of it. So if you're sad listening to sad songs, then you slowly start getting into Tift's happier songs and the pop songs. You can kind of shift your mood, which is so cool that you can kind of change your mood just on music. But you could also have prompts while you listen to music or exercise or move more or do a task you've been putting off. So like you can try and pair music with being active or you know doing stuff you need to take care of or dancing With a blanket.
Speaker 2:Yes, yeah exactly Over.
Speaker 1:You like it's a dress and just running around getting on your knees and really belting it out, Sure.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Cathartic.
Speaker 2:So, like I said before, learning or playing an instrument can help too. So active music making engages your entire brain so it can like your brain doesn't have time to focus on other stuff, because it's being engaged and, in many different ways, being creative. Normally it's a motor skill thing. You know just lots of stuff happening up here, lots of cylinders firing. I was like what's that? Car analogy?
Speaker 1:What is?
Speaker 2:that in there, so that this has an example of a steel tongue drum, for example, set up in a pentatonic scale, has a beautiful resonance sound and has no wrong notes and, by design, allows you to just play long notes and, by design, allows you to just play. So this was like. This is an example they gave of instruments that are designed for easier access, for expression or learning, so like if you didn't know any music, you could just like bang on it and it would still sound good. Where a piano you know, there's like sharp notes and like out of key and all that stuff, so that can be great for a beginner.
Speaker 2:Also, it mentions ukulele. I play some uke songs or whatever, she's a little uker. Okay, I wouldn't call myself that, I'd call myself a pianist, but sure.
Speaker 1:Thank you, thank you for saying it again.
Speaker 2:Yep, no problem. And then, last thing, singing. So this can be if you have a good connection to your voice or have a good music therapy relationship, where they can help you build a connection to your instrument, which that sounds interesting. There are physical benefits of singing on lung function and emotional benefits of singing lyrics that speak your truth. So all those people who, yeah, have the lyrics about their life or trauma, it helps them, I think, process it and also just deal with it.
Speaker 1:Is this why we sing in the shower? People who can't sing, I can't sing.
Speaker 2:Do you sing about trauma in the shower? I don't know, like people who can't sing, like I can't sing, do you sing about trauma in the shower?
Speaker 1:Well, I'm not singing about my trauma, but like I sing music. Like all of a sudden I'll just start singing, like you know, when there's no music on, but I'm using my voice and I'm singing in the shower and like again, larry, he'll be singing in the shower and it'll be 4 am in the morning and I'll just hear him go, kelly, and I'm like that's great, that's cute. Yeah, he always puts my voice in his songs, so he'll be rapping. You mean your name, yeah, my name in his songs. So he'll be like rapping something and all of a sudden he'll be like Kelly.
Speaker 2:But again, it's 4 in the morning and I don't need to hear my name being screamed from the bathroom because that's like instant, wake up. Cute, yeah, we're fucking adorable. Yeah, yeah, you are. But my last point that I just wanted to make that a psychologist in music therapy in chicago mentions is if you want to give yourself a break from, like the emotions you're going through, pick a song that has a storyline different from the challenges you're facing, because it can, like transport you elsewhere and give you a short break from your concerns, just like a good book, like when you read a good book, and really get you dive in. So if you're like in a sad mood and you kind of want to get out of it, maybe listening to a happier song, so music really does help, like it's science backed, which is really cool. So, yeah, anyway, that's my story in music. I'm sticking with it.
Speaker 1:I like it, I believe it and I believe I've done a few of those things that you've mentioned. I really rely on done a few of those things that you've mentioned. I really rely on music a lot. I like seeing my Spotify wrap up at the end of the year and comparing it to others and they're always like you.
Speaker 1:listen to how much this year and I'm like, well, it's just always on, especially when I worked in the kitchen, I had control of the playlist. So you'd see, at the end of the year it'd be like an insane amount of music was played and it was, yeah, but then it keeps your mood going. Yeah, you know, that's another good point too. Working in the kitchen and being on the line and having all that. You know I can't stand the heat. Get out of the kitchen, yeah, no, when you play some Billy Joel in the kitchen, you can handle the heat. And then all of a sudden those tickets line up. You might want to change it. Put on a little like X gone gave it to you. Put on a little DMX, and then all of a sudden those tickets start flying and food goes out. But yeah, no food, not food. I like that. That was really good. That was really good.
Speaker 2:Thanks, kimberly, thanks girl, thanks for saying that let's jump into this book let's meet our inner child.
Speaker 1:Yes, that's chapter seven, meeting our inner child.
Speaker 2:Chapter seven Listen to us making music already. Maybe that's why we do it. That's why we sing words.
Speaker 1:I sing words a lot like in my personal life, in my work life and anything, anything, just always singing singing, not always, but I don't have a good voice to sing, but I could sing words. So what do we got here? We're doing?
Speaker 2:chapter seven meet your inner child, right, yep with from how to do the Work by Dr Nicole LaPera. What attachment style are you? So attachment theory is our relationship with our primary parent figures how it's the foundation of the dynamics of all the relationships we have in adulthood. I've seen this study before in a psych class. I remember seeing the video of like these moms leaving the room and like some babies crying and others are just like okay, I wonder.
Speaker 1:I wonder if we had the same. We probably saw the same video.
Speaker 2:Probably. I mean, I don't know. Yeah, it's like so you know it's old Cause. Like like the camera quality, is it the greatest?
Speaker 1:But yeah, like the camera quality isn't the greatest, but yeah, I was. I had a secure, I had a secure attachment style.
Speaker 2:Me too. That's funny yeah.
Speaker 1:I did too.
Speaker 2:And look at us now I think I might've had like anxious resistant at some point Cause, like I think about how I not was clingy to my mom, cause I was able to like be independent and know my mom was there, but I think my own like, because maybe I had sisters or you know I had to split my mom's time or whatever that even sometimes when my parents were there. You know, I might still be anxious or something like that, but for the most part, yeah, I was secure as well. And it says research has shown time and again that people who had secure attachments in infancy tend to have secure attachments in adulthood, showing the remarkable lifelong effects of our parental bonds.
Speaker 1:That's hilarious. Hilarious, I guess, as long as it makes sense, yeah, no, no, it does make sense. It makes sense. My bipolar just gets in the fucking way.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean that's like a completely different thing.
Speaker 1:It makes sense because I'm sitting here and I'm like I don't know about that, but no, it is that. But then it's the bipolar that comes in and throws a grenade on everything.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I feel like illnesses will do that, but what did you really connect with in this chapter? Kelly or thought was interesting.
Speaker 1:The inner child. Archetypes.
Speaker 2:Oh yes, which one are you?
Speaker 1:I'm not the caretaker, I'm not the overachiever, not the underachiever, I'm not the rescuer or protector.
Speaker 2:Ah, shit, I'm running out of options.
Speaker 1:I'm the fucking life of the party, aren't I? Yeah, I think you are. This is the always happy and cheerful comedic person who never shows pain, weakness or vulnerability. It's likely that this inner child was shamed for their emotional state. Believes that the only way to feel okay is to receive love, and receive love is to make sure that everyone around them is happy, or the hero worshiper.
Speaker 2:No.
Speaker 1:I guess I'd be the life of the party. Yeah, are you a?
Speaker 2:yes, person, I am multiple, I am the caretaker. Okay, partial overachiever, because in high school my sister was a lot smarter than me. I'm a rescuer protector. I've realized with my anxiety comes, I like to have control, so that position of power. I'm a bit of the life of the party, because when you said, make sure that everyone around them is happy, I like people to be happy, so in that I'm like a people pleaser.
Speaker 1:That's the yes person. I'm also a yes person. You're just. You can't be everything Kimberly.
Speaker 2:Yeah, she has literally named all of them. She's literally naming all of them. There's seven and you've named five out of seven. I'm not an underachiever. Yeah, and you're not a hero. You're not a hero worshiper. No, I kind of am.
Speaker 1:Do you need a guru to follow? No, but like.
Speaker 2:I know one the way to receive love is to reject their own needs.
Speaker 1:I know a bald guy with baby teeth that you could follow bald guy with baby teeth that you could follow.
Speaker 2:Okay, no, kelly, shut that down, shut that down. But I think the caretaker is probably the one because it kind of mixes, a bit of all of them.
Speaker 1:I see that for you too. Typically comes from codependent dynamics. Gains a sense of identity and self-worth through neglecting their own needs. Okay, as long as you feel good about that. Believes that the only way to receive love is to cater to others and ignore their own needs. Oh girl.
Speaker 2:That's real. I've had to work in therapy a lot how I need to basically be selfish when it's because the opinions of others matter a lot to me and you know I'm always trying to talk to other people, make sure other people are okay and it's like no, you got to take care of yourself. So I've been working on that a lot.
Speaker 1:You have to take care of yourself first so you can be your best self for other people, yeah. And then there's a whole section on childhood fantasies in here. Yeah, I mean, did you like that section? Yeah, I didn't. She gives these examples of these people.
Speaker 1:She does this example about Nancy having fantasies, looking for a longing hero. So in here it's like she liked Duran Duran, but she dropped them from the fantasy that she had. But later on, her crushes and her boyfriends they always failed to live up to the pressure of the unattainable pedestal she placed them on, and when they failed her she'd go find another person to fantasize about, and that often led her to seeking emotional and physical affairs, each of which would last until she found herself in exactly the same place again, unhappy, unfulfilled, desiring yet another escape hatch that right there I identify. I put expectations on people that are boyfriends specifically, that make no sense. Nobody can ever meet those expectations and they're on a pedestal. And then every time they can't meet an expectation, that pedestal gets another knockdown, and another knockdown, and another knockdown until it's over. And then I find something else to fantasize about and go after.
Speaker 2:And yeah, how do you think that's changed in your current relationship, if at all?
Speaker 1:Well, I'm in one.
Speaker 2:so Well I mean yeah, but do you hold Larry on a pedestal?
Speaker 1:Well, I'm in one, so it's work, it's changed. No, it's like patterns, so it's just understand. Like at this point in my life, I understand I put expectations on people that don't make sense. They don't even make sense to put on myself. So I just have to remind myself of that when I do get into arguments or conversations with my partner that like hey, they didn't even know that you wanted this from them. Like what the fuck are you doing right now? Like they are looking at you like you have five heads, kelly. They did not know that you expected this. How else would anyone supposed to react? Yeah, I like that. I daydream a lot.
Speaker 1:I have a lot of different fantasies, Not sexual things. When I say fantasies, I'm just out in my head. Sexual things Like when I say fantasies, just you know, I'm just out in my head.
Speaker 2:Yeah yeah. I kind of resonated with the similar story where she says the romantic liaisons provide an escape. The same principle applies to other fixations. People think they will be saved or fulfilled once they get a great job, buy a house or have children. They check all the boxes. Yet once they've achieved their goals, they find themselves just as unhappy, if not more so. I love that.
Speaker 2:I love that so much I feel like that's the way everybody works, like okay, in the next job I'll be happier. Or like once I start working out, everything will change, or whatever. Know, whatever it is, and it's just interesting that it's like no, it's gonna take more than a new house to like change stuff.
Speaker 1:My therapist calls it putting lipstick on a pig. Yeah, like when you think like, oh well, this one thing, like oh I'm gonna, we're gonna have a baby, and then everything's gonna be fine, it it's like no, it's not. I was in a place in my life and I just bought a condo with this guy I was with and shit was going downhill for a year before we even moved into the condo and that entire year my therapist was telling me like you're putting lipstick on a pig. And the lipstick was that there was this gorgeous A-frame wall in the condo and all I wanted to do was paint it like this gorgeous navy blue and put down like wood floors. And I was, that's all I could focus on and I was like I just want my blue wall and she's like you just want lipstick on a pig.
Speaker 2:Wow, you have a very forward therapist.
Speaker 1:I do, I do. I enjoy her very much. We've been seeing each other for years, so she can call me on my shit rather quickly, because there's no need to go through that. And why do you think you did that? It's like I already know why this bitch thinks she did that. This is an hour. We got an hour to do this. Let's get right to it like.
Speaker 2:This is an hour we got an hour to do this, let's get right to it. Yeah, let's get to it quick, yeah, yeah, well, I mean, I think a lot of people do that. They just may not recognize it or don't want to acknowledge it, like a lot of people I've heard in marriages I can't speak from experience, but like in marriages where people are like things are bad, let's have a kid because that will help. I talked to an old coworker years ago and she's divorced and then she got remarried and she's like yeah, she's like I love my two kids. I wouldn't traded them for the world, but we had the second kid because we're like okay, let's see if this would help our marriage. And it obviously didn't.
Speaker 2:And it's like, and it obviously didn't.
Speaker 1:And it's like there is no bandaid to fixing issues that need stitches. I like that there's no bandaid to fixing issues that need stitches.
Speaker 2:That might be the name of this episode. Done, I did your job for you.
Speaker 2:But, it's just like, no, you can't do something else, thinking it's going to improve that. It's like when people get liposuction or something and then the fat comes back and it's like, well, you didn't change your eating, you still aren't active. And I'm not judging people who are overweight. I'm overweight, but still it's like you can't try and just be like I'm going to take the easy way out or this one thing will make everything better, and it's like you have to once again, do the work.
Speaker 1:Gosh this freaking book. I know, and I knew that's where that sentence was going. I was like she's going to say it's how you do the work.
Speaker 2:I'm going to say it Because that's where it's got to go.
Speaker 1:It can't go anywhere else. Yeah, before, before we jump off of this, what I thought was really interesting here, and this is also something that me and my therapist talk about not that I've ever done this homework before, but writing, write an inner child letter to yourself. So, like you have, as it's been described to me, I've done parts therapy with my therapist, so it's like there's different parts of Kelly parts therapy with my therapist. So it's like there's different parts of Kelly. There's, you know, there's a child Kelly, there's a teenage Kelly, then there's this version of me that was in college and there's a version of me that was in my twenties. And you know, they all have different names and they all have different traumas associated with them.
Speaker 1:So a lot of times, my child self will come up in my anxieties and come to the top and be like we can't do this, we can't do this, we're not doing, like this is too much. Or it might want to do the same pattern that it's used to, so say my pattern was being a yes person. Then it might be like okay, we're going to yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. And that's when you have to acknowledge like okay, hi, little child, hi, child Kelly, so nice to see you, but don't worry, 34-year-old Kelly is here. I've done this before. I can do this now. I appreciate that you've come up and you just kind of like acknowledge that, okay, there's a part of me that is scared about this or excited about this or whatever it is, and that part is inappropriate for what's going on. And so you kind of got to step in and talk to yourself.
Speaker 1:And that's when Nicole, in here, she has these little essays to herself, these little letters, does like these little. She has these little, uh little essays to herself, these little letters, yeah, dear little caretaker, nicole. And then it's like I see you, I hear you, I love you, always wise adults, nicole. So she like signs these letters from like an adult Nicole, but also acknowledging that she hears them. So my therapist kind of taught me to do that like in real time, just to be like, yeah, you might get, you get nervous, like when you're going into a job interview, but you're, you're not that. You know that seven-year-old kelly who got made fun of for you know, coming in on like you know, mismatch a day with not mismatched socks, you know whatever it is like that stupid little trauma that stuck with you.
Speaker 1:It's like you're gonna show up and you're gonna be messed up because you have like one thing wrong with you, just like that one day back in like 1994. And I guess I could talk about this for a while, but I really liked that part because that resonated with me, because that's a lot of good work that I've done with my therapist.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think it's important to acknowledge, like your childhood or your inner child or, yeah, the younger version of yourself, which I have never really done, so it's it's kind of new for me, but it's scary but exciting to look back and it's almost like telling yourself like hey, we've achieved great things. And it's kind of cool to reflect and be like, okay, we wanted a house when we were young and we have that you know, and there's so many people that don't.
Speaker 2:And then yeah, and like just to yeah, to talk to your like inner child and say, hey, you know we're good, you know we got this, let's keep growing, you know, whatever. Yeah, I think that's really cool.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, yeah yeah. It helped me get through a lot of different things. It's something I'm out of practice with right now, but you know, when you talk to your therapist and then you're like, oh yeah, I like you're actively practicing something. And then it's like well, I haven't seen my therapist in like two weeks and I kind of like forgot to do that part stuff when I was like yeah, yeah, but oh yeah, I know that all too well. Well, that was good. Next week we'll do chapter eight.
Speaker 1:So, listeners if you're following along. Chapter eight is what is it called? What do we got?
Speaker 2:I already started it, so.
Speaker 1:Oh, she already started it Ego Stories. Look at you Ego Stories. That's the one right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and there's 13 chapters in this, this book, so we are more than halfway done cool ego stories looks like it'll be interesting.
Speaker 1:I'm sure we'll have a lot to talk about there a lot a lot of huge egos we have huge. Uh, all right, well, this has been another fun podcast podcasting podcasting, let's say podcast. One more time podcast we appreciate everybody listening to the podcast. We would love if you would rate and review the podcast. Notice how many times I'm saying podcast podcast rate review please and we love doing this. Uh, we want to build a community with everybody that listens to us and just remember when you're here you're never alone.